An understanding of social influence strikes me as something that *MUST* be a moving target, different as time goes by and depending on the context in which it is applied. Coming from a science background, I finally got my head around (at least partly) the concept of a model or a lens or a framework for analysis that is useful, but not *THE TRUTH* or the final answer. This comes up all the time in educational research on, for instance, how we should teach or what needs to be done to improve education, or...substitute your favorite question or issue. The answers differ depending on what your assumptions are about the purpose of education and personal values. And even when people agree, there is simply not one right answer. "Getting" this actually helped me to understand that science also consists mainly of models with explanatory value that are useful until or unless a better model is constructed using new data or concepts. It made me less focused on pinning down social constructs with answers based on empirical research. Context is everything.

I suspect you heard about it from my Twitters, considering the valid nagging I got from you about not mentioning it earlier!!!

And I can definitely see how the social behaviours aspect should be included in some way. I suspect the reason that it didn't come up at the initial meet was due to the overwhelming concerns of most people there, that we're all experimenting and using social media, but have no ways to judge success within markets etc due to a lack of benchmarks and consistent measurements - and the need to justify investment/show returns as an agency or a client.

I believe the plan is to have monthly meetings - at least to begin with - so hopefully you'll be at the next one...

Hi Chris! I am so glad you are coming to Podcamp NYC!! Based on your last post alone, I cannot wait to chat at Podcamp! I am having you lead off the Education track on Saturday (if that's okay), as I think this is a great way to open up the day.

Chris Brogan was posting about a new filter tool this morning, and he wanted to know about human factors. I responded that the the old days, a secretary did this work for you- a real person, creating a clip file- but that's not an internet free service!

The bottom line is that we can't factor people out of the online equation- everything cannot be automated and still have the feel we need it to without taking the sociological factors into account. Cognitive psychology, motivation theory and the like are just as important when looking at online communities, and how to make them durable over time.

Email me if you get a chance- would love to share coffee at the very least at Podcamp NYC

Whitney

Part of the problem with measurement is the notion of specifying precisely *what* it is that is being measured... Opinion leadership? Viral registrations? Product/brand awareness? Product/brand recall? Intention to purchase? Actual buyer/adopter behaviour?

Then you have the 'moving target' phenomenon of any of the above classifications, measured over time, and based on social, economic, political and technological changes in the marketplace.

For a long time, I've been interested in developing a suite of criteria for determining an appropriate measure of influence, rather than seeking a single system of measuring influence. This set of criteria would assist strategists in providing a launch pad for measurement rather than resorting to the collation of ad hoc statistics and data that can be meaningless or even deceptive. Back in February, a Chinwag gig in London considered the issue and the consensus was that it would be useful to have an open source-style conversation and collective research effort in developing the range of social media influence tools and measurement techniques - pretty much what was recommended at MeasurementCamp. But what we need to ensure is that the initiative doesn't get bogged down in the interests of *just* the technologists, or *just* the marketers and statisticians. The only way in which such a system would work is if all stakeholders can collaborate to produce at first, a range of measurement techniques, and then a series of criteria or a decision assistant focusing on which measurement techniques are appropriate at given times of a product/business lifecycle.

This is *not* an easy task. But it will be massively useful, for technologists and decision makers alike.

Not only the processes for the devloped product/idea have changed. Social interaction also influences R&D of the product/idea (your piece being a case in point). Often consumers are now involved at a much earlier stage of development than ever before influencing the actual outcome of the R&D stage.

Instead of closed, selected target groups that give their opinion on a concept during R&D the general public can now get involved. Whether that is good or bad remains to be seen.

Great piece Chris and very thought provoking.

I have a lot of time for Will and what he is trying to do and know some of the folks that attended there (having had a few client meetings with them too!) - there is certainly the understanding and skills to make something extremely positive come out of this.

With regards to diagram 1.2, it is very representatve of a lot of client thinking (and to some extent, the way the agency feels obliged to think too). "Social Media" has, in most cases, a very woolly ROI to it and clients struggle to justify the open-endedness of activity within a network compared to a more measurable medium (banners or PPC).

As such, organisations look to either moneitse directly from the "social media" activity because it is the shortest, most direct route to a measurable result, or try and tie the actvity in with another medium they are already comfortable with measuring (SEO for example).

For this very reason we end up not moving any closer towards diagram 1.3.

I/we as a result, frequently end up having to present blogging/social media activity in with two "conventionally" accepted ways of measurement - 1) market research and 2) SEO - in order to get buy-in from new clients. Once on board, it becomes much easier to extoll the virtues of community building (diagram 1.3).

Number 1): Market Research
Organisations understand market research and as such, however new the aforementioned toolset is, it is still within the average Joe's ability to understand what we are looking to achieve. Online research of the type we use (understanding who the key influencers are, discovering what they are saying and finally, measuring the sentiment of their comments) however new, still provides results that the organisation understands.

Number 2):
Likewise, as Will will testify (is that poor English?!), using blogs to promote SEO benefits is a) a fact, and b) very powerful and bridges that gap between a new, uncomfortable medium and an already measured metric. As such, I feel that the opportunity to move towards diagram 1.3 lies here.

As PPC prices rocket, clients are actively looking for ways to do things more effectively, cheaper but importantly, as quick as PPC allows them to.

The blog (for example) is one such device and permits the client to control (and get a grip on) to some extent, the level of community management they may expect to entail if they did go full-tilt into a social environment such as that depicted in 1.3.

They then begin to see a path to full community management and a way to arrive much more favourably, at their end goal.

Just a few thoughts...would be interested to see where this all goes now!